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    Home Unlabelled Hardware support: The Wi-Fi Alliance is issuing Wi-Fi 6 certification to devices that don't meet Wi-Fi 6 requirements. Check device certificate before buying

    Hardware support: The Wi-Fi Alliance is issuing Wi-Fi 6 certification to devices that don't meet Wi-Fi 6 requirements. Check device certificate before buying

    April 14, 2020

    Hardware support: The Wi-Fi Alliance is issuing Wi-Fi 6 certification to devices that don't meet Wi-Fi 6 requirements. Check device certificate before buying

    The Wi-Fi Alliance is issuing Wi-Fi 6 certification to devices that don't meet Wi-Fi 6 requirements. Check device certificate before buying

    Posted: 13 Apr 2020 09:30 AM PDT

    TL,DR: What this means in practical terms is it severely complicates consumer ability to check router/AP theoretical performance independently of OEM claims. In others words, it aids and abets OEM deception. This is unconscionable from a certification organization.

    Like all good r/hardware folks I often window shop products I have no intention of buying myself just so I know what to recommend to people when they ask.

    I'm an enterprise AP guy through-and-through, but most people ask about routers. As such and as a continuation of last week's max theoretical throughput derivation exercise, I decided to find Wi-Fi 6 certified US-available routers.

    The Wi-Fi Alliance's Wi-Fi 6 announcement implies the following are the requirements for certification:

    Wi-Fi CERTIFIED 6 delivers advanced security protocols and requires the latest generation of Wi-Fi security, Wi-Fi CERTIFIED WPA3™. Advanced capabilities available in Wi-Fi CERTIFIED 6 include:

    • Orthogonal frequency division multiple access (OFDMA): effectively shares channels to increase network efficiency and lower latency for both uplink and downlink traffic in high demand environments

    • Multi-user multiple input multiple output (MU-MIMO): allows more downlink data to be transferred at once and enables an access point to transmit data to a larger number of devices concurrently

    • 160 MHz channels: increases bandwidth to deliver greater performance with low latency

    • Target wake time (TWT): significantly improves battery life in Wi-Fi devices, such as Internet of Things (IoT) devices

    • 1024 quadrature amplitude modulation mode (1024-QAM): increases throughput in Wi-Fi devices by encoding more data in the same amount of spectrum

    • Transmit beamforming: enables higher data rates at a given range resulting in greater network capacity

    Sounds good, right? That means the only difference among Wi-Fi 6 routers/APs should be spatial stream count (e.g. 4x4, 2x2, 8x8, etc.)

    Unfortunately, that does not seem to be the case in practice. Case in point: the Linksys MX5 Velop AX Whole Home WiFi 6 System, SKU MX5300. Its certificate (PDF warning) mentions only 80 MHz max channel width support, not the 160 MHz it should support per the Alliance's own statements.

    "Oh that's just Linksys," you say. No it's not. Cisco's Meraki MR56 is guilty of the same thing (PDF warning) too. Did I mention the MR56 retails for almost 1300 USD?

    Now, not all OEMs are doing this nonsense. The other US-available (though currently out of stock at reputable retailers across the country) Wi-Fi 6 certified router, the ASUS RT-AX88U, does support 160 MHz channel width (PDF warning).1

    What to look for on Wi-Fi Alliance Wi-Fi 6 router/AP certificates

    The following should be in the Security section:

    WPA3™ - Personal

    The following should be in the Wi-Fi CERTIFIED 6™ section:

    1. OFDMA
      1. DL OFDMA
      2. UL OFDMA
    2. MU-MIMO
    3. Maximum Supported Channel Width (20, 40, 80, 160 MHz)
    4. Target Wake Time (TWT)
    5. MCS 10-11 Rx (= 1024-QAM)
    6. Beamforming

    If any of those are missing, do not buy that router or access point.

    1 As others have pointed out:

    • The RT-AX88U's spec sheet doesn't mention WPA3

    I believe this is because either the certified hardware rev is different from the retail one, or the spec sheet simply hasn't been updated. The RT-AX88U's FAQ mentions WPA3 and how to enable it.

    • The RT-AX88U support 5 GHz OFDMA only

    I have not seen any information direct from the WFA specifying which bands a device has to support OFDMA on/for. It appears that once a device supports OFDMA on a band, it meets Wi-Fi 6's OFDMA requirements, regardless of which band(s) that is. The belief that the OFDMA requirement covers both 2.4 and 5 GHz bands appears to stem from an unsubstantiated statement by SmallNetBuilder back in January of this year.

    submitted by /u/jdrch
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    In theory, could the info released about the ps5 in the GDC talk video indicate it can have backwards compatibility with ps2 and ps1?

    Posted: 13 Apr 2020 07:26 AM PDT

    I am not sure if this belongs here as the question probably isn't solely about hardware. If this is the case, i am sorry.

    During the video it was said/confirmed that ps5 will run ps4 games. I am not an expert on the topic, but, if i understood right, basically the system will lower its clockspeed and explore the similarity of archtectures to emulate the ps4.

    As far as i understand, this means that the ps5 could also run the ps2 games/emulator available on ps4, maybe it would require some extra work on it, but still possible.

    The ps1 part is a kind of stretch of this idea. If, originally, the ps2 could run ps1 games, then, perhaps, these games would also be playable through the emulator.

    So, what do you think? Is this all a possibility or am i just too hopeful/ too noob to understand the intricate details that would need to be considered for this to work?

    submitted by /u/Tiplouf_de_Geladeira
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